Reply to PostGoogle the Georgia Guidestones. Apparently the elite believe that humans are at balance with nature at 500,000 people. 500,000 is a little under 7% of the world's population now. Adam does want to save the world, just in a different way. From his 400 years of experience and wisdom, he learned that humans (the real virus) must be sacrificed to save the world. Peter is naive and narcissistic and thinks that saving the world means saving the people.
93% - Is Adam Objectively Good?
-
Posted 11/30/2007 6:33:18 PM #
-
Wow! Good point curious. I googled that - very interesting....I tried saying this about Adam in a much less convincing fashion in another forum. I basically posed the question that Adam may be the real good guy, fighting against a power or system (the company, the world at large) that has long been established and considered to be the good guy. I should point out that while still a very small number in relation to the current population of earth, the exact figure for population equilibrium according to that glyph is 500,000,000, not 500,000.
Back to Adam and how he is seen as a bad guy.....it's kind of like how Neo, Trinity and Morpheus were labeled as terrorist inside the matrix, while in reality - they were fighting for a real cause they believed in.... Adam is portrayed as evil because the majority don't understand where he's coming from. And in a different parallel, the agents outlook was actually more like what you describe with Adam in that they viewed humans as a virus too, just consuming mother earth to death - and they were the ones to stop them. And even though Hiro was targeted (along with others) as a terrorist in the episode "5 years gone" he was fighting a war that required a sacrifice that those around him couldn't comprehend. But what it really came down to in that episode was that Sylar was really the President of the U.S. and just wanted to eliminate all of his rivals to secure his power. I'm sure that's what the ruling class in England did (or tried to do) to our founding fathers onced they rebelled, ignited the revolution and broke away from the tyranny.
It sounds like Adams philosophies had really taken hold of Linderman during his mentorship. Funny how this season the virus kills all but 7% and last season, the nuclear explosion was supposed to eliminate only .07% "an acceptable loss by anyones means" - Daniel Linderman. That episode and '5 years gone" really throw some strong 9/11 symbolism and references out there. When Linderman speaks of igniting a horrible disaster just so it can rally the world toghether in a "united sense of fear" reminds me of how scary our government has become and how scary the ruling class in society has always been.
Raz Al Ghul and his league of shadows from Batman believed in the same thing. Purge the world of excess thru harsh means - like a natural wildfire. Sometimes life has to be destroyed for it to regrow. Happens all the time to the little innocent skin cells everytime you shave. To them it's a tornado wiping them off the face of the planet.
But I digress......I understand that way of thinking - it's kind of a big-picture thing. I think most people typically say "let's leave those decisions to god, or nature"....because even if we understand their point of view, it's still very hard to accept the loss of human life. Is it obvious that I feel strongly about this subject?
And yes, Peter is a bit naive - but maybe he is purely the embodiment of good on the show, like superman. Peter is open minded, and doesn't always see everything in terms of black and white, but he doesn't want to be sympathetic to that point of view because to him it's 'just wrong'. Plus his girlfriend is in danger of being deleted by either the virus or the space-time continuum.
Holy shit - I guess I like this show. I like it becasue it touches on this stuff in a very subtle way and makes me think deep about history and the current state of things....thanks for setting me off!
Posted 11/30/2007 7:36:58 PM # -
Yeah, anytime the established majority find some minority rebels to label as heretics, it's usually game over for them because everyone jumps on the bandwagon assuming that the majority is always right. That is until new evidence to the contrary is discovered and hindsight is 20/20.....which is human nature in action.
I see where you both are coming from, but I still think Adams moral ratio is more like 80% evil, 20% good. He wants revenge on the company (which I think had become slowly corrupt since it's inception and/or hijacked at some point and is still swimming in very "morally dark-gray" water itself) and wants to unleash a virus that will kill nearly everyone but himself and a few other "special" people. So I question his motives - is it truly to bring balance back to the earth, or for more selfish reasons?
good topic fellas
Posted 11/30/2007 7:47:53 PM # -
Wowzers Anu Naki!!! Thanks for all your comments. I think your right on track. I wonder if Adam thought he might die from the virus, if he would unleash it? I'm not sure if his motives are really that pure. Although, I do understand the thought of humanity being a virus, since we are all consumers.
In a way, we are. I think we can change that. We have to change it or we will suffer the fate of the Heroes in the future. Most of earths enhabitants (animals, insects) have an equalibrium with the earth. Their population is kept under control by their breeding and their predators. But the common house fly population grows untill it peaks off and they all die in a mass and only a few are left. The graph of the human population is similiar to the house fly. It's rising and rising. Sooner or later it may reach that point and mass extinction may result.
So, Peters view is to change it. To help humanity before that critical climax. He might not know what that it, but it's innate in him. He knows he has to save the world either before they kill themself or someone else does, like Adam.
I'm with you Anu Naki. This show hits on a lot more than just superpowers...
Posted 12/2/2007 3:15:45 PM # -
Yeah, good point.
I recently just watched "The Matrix" again. Smith captured Morpheas for the first time and was interrogating him, and commented on the human way of life. It was something like: We (humans) "consume and consume, and once [we] have consumed everything [we] move to a new location. There is one other organism on this planet that acts like this. A virus"
I do agree that Adam's views are probably good, but I do think there is much evil in it. He wants revenge on Hiro and The Company.
And, even if he didn't release the virus, "we only have 10 years to do something about global warming before we're screwed". Ever see "The Day After Tomorrow"? Based on true possibilities.
And then if you beleive the 2012 doomsday theories (which, personally, scare the crap out of me)... we dont even have 10 years.
Yeah, anyways, Humanity has grown too much and just like the housefly thing - mass extinction is eventually going to happen. Maybe Adam wants to do it before it reaches the peak (which for all we know could be 10 billion. 6 billion -7% is better then 10 billion -7%, aint it?)
Posted 12/3/2007 2:31:34 AM # -
Thanks Monk, cadalyst and randomdude. Great comments as well. It all seems sadly inevitable. But regarding the 2012 theories, not all are angled with doomsday and end-times slant. Some say that it will simply be a period of enlightenment and a chance for humanity to evolve to a higher form.....homo luminous. A new branch of humanity that is in a constant state of equilibrium with the planet. That sounds nice. That's why Heroes hits home with me and seems to ring true.
Posted 12/3/2007 9:01:25 AM # -
Yeah... but if we DID do that - then many, many of us would die. I find it better not to think about it, because if you do, it really just brings you back to "thers a great chance i'm screwed".
And, although it might not be "the end of days", they all do include millions, if not billions of people dying. Yay!
Posted 12/4/2007 1:37:11 AM # -
or you could look at trying to figure out what it is we as a species (and as individuals) need to do to survive and move on if something like that were to happen. Like, just be more compassionate to others, meditate and actively create a more peaceful environment.........I sound like John Lennon...
But cro-magnon died off one day, neanderthal man did too. Each suceeded by another version, more adapted to this ever-changing world. It's always about survival, but back then it was more focused on the physical aspect of that survival. I think this next go round has evolved to a higher ideal - spiritual survival. Maybe soon we won't even need our bodies???
Posted 12/4/2007 1:51:06 AM # -
I've always thought this, the matrix nailed it dead on. All humans are are a virus, or plague to the world. We come in, use up all the natural resources and then spread to another spot. 500,000 seems like a good number.
Posted 12/4/2007 6:22:27 PM # -
500,000 sounds like I'm dead. Make it a bit higher xD
Spiritual bodies... maybe in a few billion years. If we last that long. Which I doubt.
And the Neanderthauls (or however you spell it) didn't completely die off. Humans evolved in africa, some spread to eurupe, evolving to neanderlsajfa;lskjdfls;jl;fkjs's. Then Humans spread, and killed all of them. There was little left and they had... fun... together. So technically you could be part neanderthaasl;fja;lsdjf :O Yeah... seen it on discovery channel a little whiel ago =D
Posted 12/5/2007 1:00:26 AM #
1
2
Total Posts: 11
